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...Andrew Weatherhead?

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...Andrew Weatherhead?

Postby jet on Mon Aug 04, 2003 9:42 am

andrew--

hey, you wouldn't happen to be the same andrew from Goiter, who i met in Evanston last sunday (the 27th)? while i doubt that there would be several of those names walking around, you never know...

thanks for responding to my cello post, though. if you are indeed the guy i'm thinking of, then of course you would know about those things.

regards, jet.
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Wow, this is weird

Postby Andrew Weatherhead on Mon Aug 04, 2003 11:38 am

Yeah, thats me. Wow, thats really cool. You might also find it interesting to know that Mike from Goiter is also registered on these forums his username is: mikewhojobshadowedsteve

Anyways, when we recorded the upright bass and violin at my house we used pickups because we all had to play in the same room because the nature of Goiter's music is such that we rely heavily on cues and signals from other members of the band. Using microphones would have caused horrendus problems with signal bleed and phase cancellation. Also, I don't really have enough mics to mic them. However, on one of the songs we overdubed the violin, in which case we used a microphone (an AT 3035) placed about a foot directly above the sound holes/bridge. I didn't do much experimenting with positioning, but this sounded pretty darn good, very close to the violin's natural sound.

When we recorded the violin and upright bass at my school's recording studio, both were miced and the instruments were isolated. The violin was miced in a similar fashion as I explained above using a Baby Bottle microphone. I can not recall the model of the microphone used to mic the bass, but it was position about 5 inches away from the sound holes and slightly angled. I am not sure the reasoning for the engineer's mic placement, I don't think there was any. The engineer we worked with wasn't very good at what he did, so I wouldn't acknowledge any of his methods.

-Andrew
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Postby jet on Mon Aug 04, 2003 1:21 pm

ha! i thought so. i doubt you would remember me, i think the only things i could say that may stand out in your memory was that i monopolised a lot of your time after your set (sorry); i'm red-headed, with bangs, and am a little taller than you. i saw you outside again when me and my two friends left. i'm not sure if i met mike, though.

at all events, as far as recording goes, i'm not sure exactly about placing a mic on a violin, but i recently saw a show (Nina Nastasia) in which the mic was placed about 2" above the violinist; it was some sort of condenser mic, but i'm not sure what type--it could have been anything. but that was a live setup. the need to pick up the sound in such a fashion obviously isn't as great in the studio; there's more room for subtleties, better mics, ambience, etc. when it comes to that type of thing, however, i would ask steve. of course, you'd think that's what i would do, but i haven't asked him about the cello thing because i annoy him enough as it is.

i'm not sure if you've ever heard/seen Nina Nastasia, but all her accompanying instrumentation is miced simultaneously. her songs are much more structured when compared to your band's...but when i saw her, there were seven people onstage, and it sounded JUST like the record (with very minor differences). from a technical perspective, it presented no real problem in regards to micing everything during the performance (providing that the sound guy isn't some stupid pud from off the street, like at most clubs). with you guys, especially at a tiny place like nevin's, i can see how it's difficult, because you were all so cramped on that stage. there's not nearly enough room for your amps and other equipment along with all of you. but i think on a larger stage--or even in a reasonably-sized room in your house--that mics would work out fine, if you were able to fashion yourselves in a way that was conducive to feedback avoidance. there are other hindrances, as well, and i'm sure you know them, but it seems to me that perhaps it's possible to overcome them. but with limited knowledge, i can't really say specifically how you could. i'm going by logic.

hmm...thinking back about your record, i personally think it sounds quite nice considering your circumstances. anything you do in a studio will almost always sound better. but while i was at your show i was really excited, because once you guys DO get into a studio, with a competent engineer (and EA has no shortage of those), i think your material will really sound excellent.

i think it says more, however, that you all work extremely well together as a group, because that two-song demo with the semi-truck cover was enough to get me to seek you guys out. so in a way, studio records can only do so much. then again, i tend to look more to the core anyway, being a musician as well.

back to the cello thing, though, i don't have an overabundance of mics, either, but i'm planning on doing some experimenting this week and seeing what sounds good (with positioning, etc). if i get anything nice, then i can let you know, if you want. the reason why i avoid doing much experimentation at home is because, as everyone knows, unless you already know what you're doing, it's a pain in the ass to be your own engineer--"let's see, this looks about right..." you sit down and it's too fucking high/low/far away/close/sounds like shit, time for a different goddamn mic...do this a few times, especially with something like a cello, which makes just leaning over for a bow/rosin/glass of water/gun to shoot yourself with/etc a rediculously big deal.

regards, jet.
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Re: Wow, this is weird

Postby sixteenrev on Mon Aug 04, 2003 2:56 pm

Andrew Weatherhead wrote:Yeah, thats me. Wow, thats really cool. You might also find it interesting to know that Mike from Goiter is also registered on these forums his username is: mikewhojobshadowedsteve


Huh.. My friend and I had a band called Goiter when we were thirteen which consisted of me and him playing guitar through a single rigged up boom-box. I think we played some Metallica covers. I remember one time this drummer from our middle school called up and played drums over speakerphone because his parents wouldn't let him leave the house.

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Postby Andrew Weatherhead on Mon Aug 04, 2003 4:13 pm

Jet:

I remember who you are, and it was very nice of you to come out to our show, thanks alot.

I have never heard Nina Nastasia, but I would suppose that they have a better live setup then we do. Our setup is usually thrown together when we setup, there is not much planning because we never know what to expect in terms of PA size, number of microphones/channels on the board, and experience of the engineer. You are lucky to have caught us playing Nevin's for the second time, because the first time was a live sound disaster. The sound guy, although a really nice guy and talented engineer, had no idea what to expect. When we started loading up and he saw the piles of amps, guitar, and misc. I think he began freaking out on the inside, while remaining calm on the outside. There weren't enough mics to mic each amp, so some amps were amplified a lot louder than others and the mix was very disproportionate to how we sound in practice. Also, the band we were playing with insisted on keeping there Fender Rhodes onstage while we opened for them, this made a tight stage even tighter and at the time we had even more equipment and more members of the band. Finally, the biggest disaster of the evening, we unplugged a cord from the computer that we usually play with and the pop the resulted could have blown the speakers. Luckily, it didn't blow the speakers, however, a few people left and I caught sight of a kid crying. Although I enjoyed this very much, it made us look like amateurs, which in a sense we are, but it kind of sucked.

Anyways, the 2 song cd with the truck on the cover is a really bad representation of the band. It was recorded with only four out of the eight members and there are tons of recording and mixing problems. However, thank you for the kind words, as that was recorded at my house as well. Yeah, we would love to record at a "real recording studio," but we have trouble booking as we have no long term plans whatsoever, and there is always the financial issue.

Finally, keep me updated on the cello/string recordings, I would like to know what works for you, and what doesn't. I am going to conduct some experiments on my own as well, I will let you know what I find.


sixteenrev:

Your Goiter sounds a whole lot better than my Goiter. If you want your name back, I would be honored to give it up.


-Andrew
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Postby sixteenrev on Mon Aug 04, 2003 4:21 pm

Andrew Weatherhead wrote:Your Goiter sounds a whole lot better than my Goiter. If you want your name back, I would be honored to give it up.


eh, its cool. treat er good.

speaking of band names, i could use one

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Goiter, Five Finger Discount

Postby Andrew Weatherhead on Mon Aug 04, 2003 8:44 pm

eh, its cool. treat er good.


I thank you kindly.

speaking of band names, i could use one


John was telling me the other day that he thought a good band name would be "Five Finger Discount." I told him that it may already be a band name, but you should look into it if you play really infectious pop-punk and are looking for some street credibility. You might want to ask John if you are really interested, which I hope you are not.

But seriously, the band Dianogah has a feature on their website where people exchange band names and song titles. Infact, Dianogah has used this to name a few of their songs. Anyways, there are some really funny names, as well as a few good ones. Here is a link: http://home.speedsite.com/dianogah/namef.html

-Andrew
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goiter

Postby mikewhojobshadowedsteve on Fri Aug 08, 2003 12:25 am

Hi Jet,

This is Mike from goiter. I don't remember meeting you at the show, but i really appreciate you coming out.
I couldn't help noticing your post about Nina Natasia--I am an intern at Touch and Go and therefore have been listening to the record "Run to Ruin" for a while now and each time I am facinated by the way the strings sound. I have never gotten the chance to see her live, but I was curious how everything would be miced...apparently they did a good job. Did you go that show at the empty bottle? Some of my friends told me how excellent the sound was.
Again, i appreciate your kind words about goiter and thank you for coming out to the show...we're actually playing Nevin's Live again on August 24.

-mike
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Postby jet on Fri Aug 08, 2003 5:33 pm

hi there, mike,

i asked my friend rich about you yesterday; he's seen your band twice, and had met you. that's how i was able to ascertain that i have not met you. i'll definitely go to your show later this month, though, and i'm sure we can meet up there.

yeah, i caught nina at the empty bottle last month. when i met steve last year, he recommended that i listen to "the blackened air," because it was stylistically comparable to what my thing (i don't have a "band", i have a "thing") is like. i mean, stylistically comparable in a sense. steve used a phrase, "abstracted music," and that effectively describes what we do. i've never really heard a band that i thought sounded like ours, and i've never patterned anything i did after any particular bands. anyway, i'm rambling...so i went out and bought her record, to listen to the quality of steve's recording, because previously i'd only heard things like jesus lizard, shellac, pegboy, slint, etc. (i only heard "in utero" three months ago. i'm pretty fucking ignorant about some stuff.) i'd never heard anything but rock-type music, but everything i'd heard, i liked, so i decided to call him. ANYWAY, when i listened to her record, i absolutely loved it, for both technical and musical aspects. i loved how all the different instruments worked together, and really wanted to see how she pulled it off live. so i went down to see her, and everything was just as pristine as it is on the records...the kid who plays violin really blew me away, and the overall blend of all musicians really worked insanely well. i think steve did a fantastic job recording it all, and hearing it definitely underlined to me the fact that his capabilities as an engineer were exactly what i wanted. combined with his many cute cats, charming wit, outgoing personality, and boyish good looks, he was choice premiere! i'm sorry, this doesn't matter. i like nina a lot. end of story.

we do not use strings in my band. we do not use drums. but i am always looking for things done interestingly and uniquely, which is why i liked your band when i first heard it. Andrew, you say that the truck demo sucks, well, we all have our regrets...i think my first record blows more cock than a two dollar whore on halsted...but that's just how it is. the technical aspects of it really annoy the living shit out of me. the engineer we used was really a pud who was an asshole to boot. and furthermore, the medium we recorded on was far less than adequate, and rich and i were still sort of learning how to play together (he plays bass). the songs weren't all as good as they could have been. But, all in all, it's not something i'm uncomfortable selling. if it was really THAT bad, it would be wrong of me to offer it in exchange for someone's hard-earned cash...and although it may make me cringe, it's not in the way that other past mistakes make me cringe.

all this goes to say that your first demo was good enough to clue me in that you would be a band i liked. i understand all that technical stuff, i understand all the member stuff, etc. but i think that you guys are good enough that all that other, well, stuff, was transcended by the true quality of the music in the first place. everything else becomes a smaller detail if the band is good enough. there are people who like our first record. because i'm so critical of its technicalities, i feel differently. but i know that is at least some representation of bov, if it's not the best. and you may feel that your truck demo isn't the best, but i was prepared to shell out some dough for it at your last show--i didn't know you had recorded anything new! so imagine how much happier i was to hear, ah, nine (and a half) EXTRA songs!

i'm sorry, complimenting people in bands i like always makes me feel kind of weird and self-conscious, so i'm going to stop now. not only you, but steve may read this, and find out that i think he does a good job, and then next time he won't work nearly as hard.

sorry for blabbing on so much, about what now seems to be one huge tangent.

i won't be in touch about any of the cello stuff for a while; i'm leaving town tonight and i'll be gone for a week. it seems...it seems i'm going on, what's the word, "vacation"? is that even english? do i even remember the last time i saw one of those "vacation"-thingies? hmm...

regards,
jet.
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Postby jet on Fri Aug 08, 2003 6:48 pm

andrew,

i didn't realise you are an intern at Electrical, sorry. but a couple of months ago i saw some copies of "run to ruin" sitting in the office, maybe one of them is still around. give it a listen, if so.

jet.
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Jet

Postby Andrew Weatherhead on Sat Aug 09, 2003 1:05 am

Jet,

Yes, I am an intern here at electrical, however, I don't get any school credit for it, so my rank as an intern is somewhat lowered. Anyways, I was talking to Steve today (well, it was more like he was lecturing myself and the band) about home recording and its pros and cons. I guess the good thing about it is that more people and bands can get their ideas down and it can be distributed, whereas 15 years ago most bands never got recorded and therefore many great bands died out and were never heard from again. But the downside, as Steve was saying, is that bands do their recordings half-ass, which is essentially how we did our recordings. Ours was done kind of spur of the moment with tons of last minute changes and hardly enough time put in for the amount of material that came out of the sessions. It made me feel guilty listening to him talk about all these half-assed recordings that he hears, and I know that that is my band. However, I am extremely motivated, now, to get into a real recording studio and get some really good sounding stuff. Anyways, I am glad that you like it.

Thanks,

Andrew
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