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Attacked! by Anxiety!

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Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby jimmy spako on Thu Apr 14, 2011 6:56 am

hey internet friends.

surprisingly there has apparently never been a thread here specifically for anxiety attacks.
i decided not to put this in crap/not crap because i'm pretty sure that the poll would have turned out rather lopsided (especially if you disregard the solo records).

i had my first real full blown anxiety attack at work last week.
i teach english part time as my day job.
i had to break off my last class with twenty minutes left to go after having had to leave the room twice feigning nausea/ an upset stomach.
it was a one-on-one lesson & i think my student bought it.
everything was going fine, there was no problem in particular in the lesson, besides the fact that i didn't want to be there, but somehow i lost a grip on the conversation.
funny detail: i take notes during my lessons...grammar stuff that i hit on later, vocabulary that i make them write down at the end & just general key words to keep my head in the conversation or remarks/questions that i want to come back to. dirty industry secret: i probably take more notes in a really boring class than in a more engaging one, in part so that i don't have to have eye contact the whole time. students don't really realise this & they think the note taking is generally good, as they see that i am constantly "structuring" the lesson, no matter how free it can seem to get. anyways, during this lesson, my student was talking about taking a walk somewhere on the weekend, as a conversational warm-up, & i had written "hiking", then she went on & somehow i wrote "fucking" underneath it, probably meaning to write "hiking" again. i think i looked down at it & panicked a bit (we were sitting right across from each other at a small table), crossed it out & then started to have a full blown anxiety attack.

yesterday i had my second one, again in a lesson that was going well, towards the beginning. i excused myself, saying i was feeling unwell, went to the restroom & breathed deeply for a couple minutes till the worst had passed, then went back & said that i had been feeling dizzy/nauseous lately. i continued the lesson & it went alright. fortunately i was doing an extended listening thing with a podcast: we were listening to an episode of this american life on toxic assets/the financial crisis & i was able to prop myself up on it as it were, listening to small chunks, & stopping often to ask comprehension questions & discuss the story. it was tough but i made it through.

i called work today & told our management assistant who has been led to believe that she is assistant manager exactly what happened (without the fucking part) & that i was going to the doctor's & couldn't teach today. i dreaded doing that but she was very understanding. my doctor, who is pretty good, more of a holistic medicine guy, was already out on his easter vacation so i went to his sub. she didn't say a whole bunch but seemed to say that my symptoms were part of the greater category of depression & that i had two options: psychotherapy or medication. i asked whether she meant natural medication or prescription medication. she answered that she meant the latter. i turned down the medication, as i see that as a last resort. the fact that she went for it so quickly, she literally probably would have prescribed me something right there, talked to me for thirty more seconds & sent me on my way, that made me want to wait till my doctor comes back to talk to him & maybe get a referral for therapy if it is covered by my insurance. in the end she wanted to give me an excuse for two weeks' sick leave but i cut it down to one, so as not to piss off my employers. i now have about twelve days off from teaching. all i have to do over that time is play a couple of gigs, one here & one on the road. i have made some positive changes of late & will use this week to get really quality sleep, lots of fresh air (& sun, weather permitting), exercise, cut out the booze & just generally let go of all the bullshit i'm probably still holding on to.

my sister has had a lot of experience with these things & is helping me out from a distance, fortunately.
some good things have happened over the last months, my record is coming out soon on a great little label & i've started working on the next one & road testing a new approach live. but i've been under a lot of stress. i've been in this place way too long & am very frustrated. i've made plans to be out of here by november & now that i have made this decision i think that a lot of bile is just coming up, a lot of repressed anger & frustration.

i don't have a problem admitting when i don't know something, or coming off stage & saying "yeah, that part was pretty good, but this other thing kind of sucked, i need to work on that." but it is really hard for me to show weakness like this, to be kind of sick, not entirely in control of my body & mind. it is difficult not to just "be hard" & tough it out, especially in front of other people.

well, this is a pretty big topic & i know many of you will have very constructive things to say about it. please forgive my rambling & don't worry too much about me. instead go ahead & share your stories & advice for the benefit of the occassionally anxious on this fine forum.

best,


-jimmy
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby jimmy spako on Thu Apr 14, 2011 7:02 am

aw, shit, partial self-kerble:

Panic Attacks

i knew there was a reason i had that vague feeling of dread while pressing submit.
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby BobbyPeru on Thu Apr 14, 2011 7:11 am

i sometimes get filled with anxiety that I'll be kerbled.. it usually passes though.

be glad you weren't attacked by this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDzt6yI3Dw8
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby FuzzBob on Thu Apr 14, 2011 7:16 am

Jimmy,

I'm like you in the sense that I tend to see medication as a last resort-- not out of machismo so much as the fact that no pill will magically solve any underlying existential malaise, remove the stressors from your life or what have you.

With that said, don't close your mind to getting medication. A couple of people close to me have panic disorders, and with just enough of a dose of SSRIs, their lives have improved. They think much more clearly now, and random portions of otherwise happy lives aren't sucked into a vortex of panic at inopportune moments.

You have plenty of good things in your life-- a nice job, agreeable employers, upcoming gigs. You've also identified problems at a fairly early stage. All of these are positives. All you're doing by getting help is being good to yourself. So, go ahead and set up that appointment. I hope things get better for you really soon.
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby elisha wiesner on Thu Apr 14, 2011 7:53 am

I've had anxiety disorder since I was 20. At times it's nothing and at times it can be regular, bad panic attacks. At first I had no idea what it was and it really fucked me up. It got so bad that I quit my job and literally didn't leave my apartment for a month. My brother came up and got me and brought me back home for a while. I didn't really do anything about it at first and it got better for a while. Then it came back hard and I went to a doctor. I think the best thing for me was to realize that I wasn't alone and that this shit wasn't just happening to me but was basically a text book condition. It can be hard to explain to people what is going on, some people might just tell you to just "get over it" but whatever. Fuck them. I do not let it fuck up my life. I'm married, have a job, own a house, play in bands etc... It might suck sometimes but on the whole my life is great.

There are a number of things that can help. Therapy, good diet, exercise, sleep, omega 3's, meditation and last, medication. Don't be afraid of any of them and find what works for you. One thing to remember is that panic/anxiety attacks suck but they always get better. Feel free to pm me for more info.
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby petercobber on Thu Apr 14, 2011 11:26 am

elisha wiesner wrote: There are a number of things that can help. Therapy, good diet, exercise, sleep, omega 3's, meditation and last, medication. Don't be afraid of any of them and find what works for you. One thing to remember is that panic/anxiety attacks suck but they always get better. Feel free to pm me for more info.


This, is very good advice and very true.

One thing when it comes to medication...you can have it (even on you), and never use it, but just knowing that you have it if you need it makes the anxiety less frieghtening and decreases the frequency of attacks.

Talk therapy helps greatly because it goes to the source of why many people have anxiety -- they do not express their true emotions to anyone for whatever reason (e.g. too macho, too shy, fear of being critisized, etc.)
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby itchy mcgoo on Thu Apr 14, 2011 11:41 am

petercobber wrote:One thing when it comes to medication...you can have it (even on you), and never use it, but just knowing that you have it if you need it makes the anxiety less frieghtening and decreases the frequency of attacks.


This seems pretty crucial to the people around me that struggle with anxiety.
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby elisha wiesner on Thu Apr 14, 2011 11:47 am

itchy mcgoo wrote:
petercobber wrote:One thing when it comes to medication...you can have it (even on you), and never use it, but just knowing that you have it if you need it makes the anxiety less frieghtening and decreases the frequency of attacks.


This seems pretty crucial to the people around me that struggle with anxiety.



I totally agree. I have a Xanax prescription. I very rarely take the stuff. Probably haven't taken one in 2 months but it's nice to know that it's there. It can really help with an acute panic attack but more than that it's just comforting to know that I have it in case of emergency.
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby noise&light on Thu Apr 14, 2011 11:48 am

petercobber wrote:Talk therapy helps greatly because it goes to the source of why many people have anxiety -- they do not express their true emotions to anyone for whatever reason (e.g. too macho, too shy, fear of being critisized, etc.)


I think that people tend to get caught up in their automatic reactions and then in dealing with the subsequent chain of events (the excitement or problems that) that follow means that they don't always step back to examine the initial reaction. People get caught up in the heat of the moment.

And people don't always ask themselves why they react certain ways. Therapy usually asks that question.
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby tmidgett on Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:55 pm

The shitty thing about it is that it doesn't matter if you have a generally awesome life--you're still prone to do it.

You're just prone to worry about essentially nothing, which is worse! It's better if you have something substantial to zone in on!

The only new advice I have (everything else here is great) is to try to separate yourself from the anxiety. This isn't really you doing anything. You know the anxiety is bullshit, your body is just letting you down for a bit, no big deal. If you can do that, you may find the length and frequency of the episodes drops dramatically, if they don't go away altogether.

And find someone who will listen to your crazy bullshit when you're freaking out and not hold it against you. That is invaluable.
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby elisha wiesner on Thu Apr 14, 2011 1:32 pm

tmidgett wrote:The only new advice I have (everything else here is great) is to try to separate yourself from the anxiety. This isn't really you doing anything. You know the anxiety is bullshit, your body is just letting you down for a bit, no big deal. If you can do that, you may find the length and frequency of the episodes drops dramatically, if they don't go away altogether.


Take it from me this works. I have periods of no anxiety and still have times when it is more a part of my life. It's not you. It's a chemical reaction in your brain. When you look at it like this it becomes less of a big deal. It can be hard to do when your in the middle of a full on panic attack but it really helps.

And find someone who will listen to your crazy bullshit when you're freaking out and not hold it against you. That is invaluable.


Yes. My wife, family, bandmates, co-workers and close friends and I guess now the PRF are all aware of my issues and I can talk to them about it and they can deal with me when it's happening. There are literally a dozen people I could call right now if I need to and just knowing that they're there and that they'll listen is invaluable. Hiding it from people is probably the worst thing you can do.

One more thing that I find extremely helpful is that when I start to feel an anxiety attack coming on I go for a walk. Even if it's just for like 5-10 minutes. It helps regulate your breathing and generally will calm you down.

Last bit of advice is try not to let it dictate your life in any way. Say you get a panic attack on a bus, don't avoid busses. Get right back on. If you get one while playing a show don't stop playing shows etc... Once you start avoiding things out of fear that you'll have an attack your world can get very small very fast. I am still usually uncomfortable in crowds but I like rock concerts and I like baseball games so I go to both. I might be a little uneasy in the first inning but fuck it.
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby ImDADA on Thu Apr 14, 2011 1:34 pm

I have depression & anxiety - I spent my first 23 years completely fine, then one night I woke up in my sleep and I wasn't breathing, I freaked out and have been a crap mess ever since. Well, I had decent 6 month remission once, it was good to drink and see people again.

It's annoying because I love my life and am a happy person but it completely controls me and everything I do, I actually feel like it has lead to other mental health issues, the stress has certainly taken it's toll. I'll give advice if I ever sort myself out.
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby Wlouch on Thu Apr 14, 2011 2:16 pm

BOOOOOOOM! Anxiety and Depression here too.

There are a fair few things that can be done, one of which is therapy to find the cause, and process it. Two, Picamilon, the BEST supplement I have ever taken, beats the shit out of prescribed anti anxiety/depression or other mood stabilising drugs. 3. being open, sounds a bit hippy, but talking about how you feel to people (who care) is a great way to help move on, and talking about how you feel if you are starting to get panicky. Trust me when i say people dont get funny about it, if you keep it to yourself you are more likely to come accross as a little off.

The root cause needs to be found though, as otherwise the other things are coping mechanisms and cover ups. The picamilon genuinely helps so much, got me through having panic attacks everyday. Don't get panic or anxiety attacks anymore.
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby jimmy spako on Thu Apr 14, 2011 2:55 pm

thanks for all the help, dööds.

one thing i wanted to say: i'm afraid sometimes i come off as if i've got shit sorted or something. my original post reads like "so i had this panic attack, right, but i totally dug my tiger teeth into it & i rode it out & nobody was the wiser, 'cause i'm awesome like that." i'm sorry for that. i'm kind of on my own & so i have to talk to myself that way i guess, i'm all "hey buddy, you'll make it" seventeen times a second. but my life isn't awesome & i'm not on top of shit. in fact i'm afraid of losing my damn mind. i've got one little thing that i've put all my energy into that is going alright & the rest is kind of fucked & way out of wack. i'm working on that, & this thing is certainly not just some random thing that inexplicably popped up in the midst of my killer day.

my lifestyle is my angststyle.

that is absolutely not to say that everybody's anxiety is caused by concrete stuff, as elisha has laid out so well (thank you) or as tim has said, with his remark that sometimes things are going swimmingly & you feel anxious anyways (i know this other feeling very well to, it's akin to the underlying awareness of death, for me).

but i think these attacks were caused by pretty solid stuff that i need to deal with.

i was sitting here imagining going back to class & having the courage to just lay out the situation simply for my students: "look, i've had a couple incidents where i felt short of breath & my heart started racing because i've been under a lot of stress, so if it should happen in class, don't take it personally, it's not related to what we're doing, & don't freak out, i'll be fine, but just bear with me & i'll get back on track after a couple minutes." thanks for hammering home this point guys, i feel a lot better imagining being able to do this.

more later maybe.
part of trying to nip this in the bud will be cutting way down on input, so i'm going to have to lurk less often & de-face a little, i'm afraid.

you are all very fine people indeed & i am very lucky that i stumbled upon this place.

thanks again,


-jimmy
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby SR-1 on Fri Apr 15, 2011 3:28 am

jimmy spako wrote:one thing i wanted to say: i'm afraid sometimes i come off as if i've got shit sorted or something. my original post reads like "so i had this panic attack, right, but i totally dug my tiger teeth into it & i rode it out & nobody was the wiser, 'cause i'm awesome like that." i'm sorry for that. i'm kind of on my own & so i have to talk to myself that way i guess, i'm all "hey buddy, you'll make it" seventeen times a second.


Welcome to Nutso-city - population you (and several million other people.) I do this a lot. I HAVE TO DO THIS. If I don't look out at the night sky and bask in its beauty, if I don't take greedy gulps of night air and assure myself that everything is as good as it can be and that I am safe, I'd be even more non-functional than I am now (most likely dead.) I couldn't count how many times I've used that mantra from Selenography :

You will be safe
You will be asleep
Someone will have their hand running through your hair
The world is full of images
Some of them will be transparent
Ghosts that only catch on video frames

You will be cared for
You won't freeze

Too many casualties to keep track of
Someone will keep track of them
You will be safe in the dark
You will be warm at night with the windows open
You will be loved
You are remembered


I'm prone to obsessive, cyclical impulses. Some of them seem like "quirks" like avoiding the colour blue (to the point where I asked Kevin for a different colour case lining) and some of them are deeply destructive. I used to have a stack of notebooks about a metre tall that I would daily pump a few thousand words into about all the ways I was failing as a human being. I lugged them around with me for years until they contributed to a immensely satisfying bonfire. Its not completely awful, depends on where you focus that energy. I'm sure Turing or Bukowski had their own array of obsessions and insecurities.

I guess that's the positive of having a mental illness. If you're frequently or constantly in a state where you feel imminent impending doom, whether through disaster or some other strange misadventure, the mentally ill person is essentially as free from fear as much as he/she is consumed by it. "Why bother?" is as applicable to the act as it is to the fear of the act or the end result or whatever. "Why bother" recording an hour long Sleep-rip-off drone about Werner Von Braun when the world is ending tonight? Why not? As if I have anything better to do with myself.

I don't know what I'm trying to say in this post. "You're not alone?" Do I need to say that? Do you realize this is a fundamental truth? (Do I?) Exercise is good. If you're going to feel exhausted and drained, might as well have a reason for it. I've spent parts of the past two days under a slasher, connecting an extremely heavy blade to the drive. Despite the imminent danger of failing hydraulics and decapitation I've seldom felt more calm in recent times. (My body is scratched and bruised and sore though.)

Sorry if this makes no sense at all.
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby Blue of Noon on Fri Apr 15, 2011 4:40 am

Sometimes I get terrible anxiety, to the extent that I feel paralyzed.

It's strange that I can perform in front of large groups of people and feel completely at ease, but then when I'm in these tedious mundane situations (that involve far less skill and specialization) my anxiety becomes something to contend with.

Anxiety and depression are two sides of the same coin, and naturally I suffer from depression too.

I recommend reading the chapters on neurosis in Ernest Becker's excellent book The Denial of Death. Reading an existentialist take on anxiety is strangely comforting, and the ways that he elaborates on his key points are fascinating.

This has already been touched upon here, but the root of anxiety is the fear of death. Man is a problematic being because he's at once creaturely and symbolic. Once you begin to understand this and its implications you can be the master of your own fate.

But who am I kidding? It's a day-to-day struggle. Finding one's balance isn't easy. Sometimes it's fucking murder out there and all you can do is brace yourself and be glad you haven't shit your pants yet!

Lately I've been spending a lot of time in the lap pool out back. No, it's not as relaxing as an erotic massage, but it is a healthy way to keep the demons at bay. Somehow being submerged in water for at least twenty minutes allows me to decompress. Life originated in the sea so it makes sense that spending time in water would be of elemental import. If you don't have a lap pool, just fill up your bathtub.
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby Dave//Eksvplot on Thu Jul 14, 2011 8:22 pm

Today, for no apparent reason, I experienced a crippling bout of anxiety and depression. I was more or less paralyzed for the first two hours of it and I'm still feeling pretty crummy, though not as bad as I was earlier. At the height of it there could have eight foxy women doing stripteases in my bedroom, rubbing their vaginas in my face and whatnot, and it wouldn't have made a stick of difference--I still would have felt like I was trapped in my body and on the verge of death. It was a dreadful feeling, easily the worst I've felt in a long time. All I could do was lie down and let the horror wash over me.

This weekend I'm meeting with old friends and we have a nice get together planned on Saturday, so there's no good reason why I should have felt so lousy all of a sudden. I'm no stranger to anxiety and depression, but usually it's reasonably manageable. Today, though...I felt powerless and had trouble breathing but there was nothing I could do about it except wait it out. It was like a migraine but without the headache.
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby rchapman75 on Thu Jul 14, 2011 8:52 pm

My sister suffered from a panic disorder for years. For a while she was self-medicating with the ol' Bolivian marching powder, then she went into therapy and replaced it with Paxil. I've never had one of the panic attacks where I'm convinced that I'm going to die or even that I won't be able to function. My anxiety manifests itself as avoidance and procrastination-- lately avoiding anything that involves leaving the apartment, so that it threatens to bloom into full-blown agoraphobia.

The best therapy for anxiety is CBT. I need to get back into CBT...
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby mr.arrison on Thu Jul 14, 2011 9:03 pm

whatever you do, DO NOT take Effexor. Run, eat well, ride a bike, lift weights but don't take pharma shit.
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Re: Attacked! by Anxiety!

Postby elisha wiesner on Thu Jul 14, 2011 9:30 pm

mr.arrison wrote:whatever you do, DO NOT take Effexor. Run, eat well, ride a bike, lift weights but don't take pharma shit.


No, this is totally horrible advice.

People are overprescribed and often a doctors first reaction is to just write a script. This sucks and the things you mention should all be tried first. Clearly it works for you when meds didn't. There are plenty of people, myself included, for whom exercise, diet etc... is not enough and have been greatly helped by a combination of those things and medication.
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