home studios equipment staff/friends booking/rates for sale forum contact

tvshow: twin peaks

Vote and debate.

Moderators: kerble, Electrical-Staff

tvshow: twin peaks

crap
16
8%
not crap
177
92%
 
Total votes : 193

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby n.c. on Mon Sep 25, 2017 4:49 pm

llllllllllllllllllllllll wrote:They had the first season on the plane and I thought I'd rewatch it. Forgot how fucking brutal that pilot is. Christ. I need to start the new season soon - I keep thinking that I need to watch the first two seasons again, though I'm not sure how necessary it is. May be unnecessarily holding myself back.



i would recommend watching fire back with me before starting season 3, but i don't/didn't think a recap of the first two seasons would be necessary. i've watched them all quite a few times, though.
User avatar
n.c.
Saint Who Rules w/ Extensive Magnanimity
Saint Who Rules w/ Extensive Magnanimity
 
Posts: 2185
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2003 3:22 pm
Location: dresden, maine

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby Anthony Flack on Fri Nov 10, 2017 4:20 pm

Finally got the time to finish it so I can safely look in this thread again. What a thing that was.

mattw wrote:I mean, even Lynch's longtime collaborators- like Michael J. Anderson and Julee Cruise- finally said enough. With JC it was a particularly bitter departure, it seems.


So bitter, she was in the finale performing a Lynch/Bandalamenti song.

Michael J. Anderson seems to be not well in the mind. He accused Lynch of abusing his daughter I think, and Jennifer Lynch was like, um dude you need to get yourself some help.

Most everybody else that Lynch has worked with in his career that are (or were) still alive seemed more than happy to be involved; in fact it was quite remarkable how much of the series seemed to be Lynch paying heartfelt tributes to all the people he worked with over the years. He even managed to get Jack Nance in there. Catherine Coulson spared some of her last dying hours to make an appearance.

It seems to me that Lynch actually has had a lifelong friendship with many of his collaborators and The Return was a love letter to all of them, but most especially Kyle McLachlan and Laura Dern.

"You've gone soft in your old age."
"Not where it counts buddy."
Anthony Flack
Greatest Man Who Ever Lived
Greatest Man Who Ever Lived
 
Posts: 8929
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2012 12:27 am
Location: New Zealand

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby Anthony Flack on Fri Nov 10, 2017 7:11 pm

brephophagist wrote:Lots of people, especially the biggest fans of the original series, felt unmoored or uneasy immediately after Part 18, myself included. Lots of theories have been floating around out there but this one is probably the most satisfying one I've read. Understand that I don't mean to equate "most satisfying" with "most correct" or anything like that.


Do I need to read Mark Frost's Final Dossier now? Following that link, it apparently confirms a couple of things at least: Audrey is in a mental hospital (has she finally broken out of her fugue state now?) and the girl in 1956 is indeed poor Sarah Palmer.

I think the theory set out there is basically right... that Laura Palmer was rescued from death and taken to some kind of pocket universe, that Cooper and Diane entered this world to retrieve Laura and take her back to the Palmer house, that this was all part of spirit Laura's plan to defeat Judy, as whispered to Cooper when they met in the Red Room, and the plan was (probably) successful in the end despite Judy's attempt to trick them, when Laura was awakened by the real Sarah Palmer breaking through and calling out to her.

(Although Cooper's "wait... what year is this?" leaves open the ominous possibility that he's overlooked something important and has once again been tricked).

Cooper is not dead and would totes return if they end up making a series 4 which they might or might not do (everybody is apparently open to the idea, with the proviso that the last series took 4 years to write and, gee a lot of people in this show have died now).
Anthony Flack
Greatest Man Who Ever Lived
Greatest Man Who Ever Lived
 
Posts: 8929
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2012 12:27 am
Location: New Zealand

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby andteater on Mon Nov 13, 2017 11:22 am

Anthony Flack wrote:Do I need to read Mark Frost's Final Dossier now? Following that link, it apparently confirms a couple of things at least: Audrey is in a mental hospital (has she finally broken out of her fugue state now?) and the girl in 1956 is indeed poor Sarah Palmer.

I think the theory set out there is basically right... that Laura Palmer was rescued from death and taken to some kind of pocket universe, that Cooper and Diane entered this world to retrieve Laura and take her back to the Palmer house, that this was all part of spirit Laura's plan to defeat Judy, as whispered to Cooper when they met in the Red Room, and the plan was (probably) successful in the end despite Judy's attempt to trick them, when Laura was awakened by the real Sarah Palmer breaking through and calling out to her.

(Although Cooper's "wait... what year is this?" leaves open the ominous possibility that he's overlooked something important and has once again been tricked).

Cooper is not dead and would totes return if they end up making a series 4 which they might or might not do (everybody is apparently open to the idea, with the proviso that the last series took 4 years to write and, gee a lot of people in this show have died now).


Final Dossier is worth it and gives some insight into the bolded section above.

andyk
User avatar
andteater
man forced to eat beard
man forced to eat beard
 
Posts: 1863
Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2003 1:29 pm
Location: south loop

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby andyman on Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:09 pm

I get the feeling Frost and Lynch are on different paths with this stuff and Lynch doesn't really care if his material matches up with Frost's histories. I don't think Lynch ever even read The Secret History of Twin Peaks, for one thing.
offal wrote:I just want to be able to play bitchin' single-stroke rolls before I die
User avatar
andyman
Humankind's Greatest Musical Genius
Humankind's Greatest Musical Genius
 
Posts: 4128
Joined: Sat Apr 15, 2006 9:31 am
Location: Cambridge

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby andteater on Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:49 pm

andyman wrote:I get the feeling Frost and Lynch are on different paths with this stuff and Lynch doesn't really care if his material matches up with Frost's histories. I don't think Lynch ever even read The Secret History of Twin Peaks, for one thing.


True, but I also think way too many people assume that Frost is a total square and that none of the weirdness of the show came from him. I suspect it did.

andyk
User avatar
andteater
man forced to eat beard
man forced to eat beard
 
Posts: 1863
Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2003 1:29 pm
Location: south loop

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby Anthony Flack on Mon Nov 13, 2017 6:04 pm

Lynch says that if an artwork has all of its secrets revealed then it becomes putrefied in your mind and the magic is gone. To that end I think he likes to keep a part of it mysterious to himself, even. Who knows how much of the plot stuff in the books were things they had talked about previous. They both seem to have gone nuts creating connections and allusions throughout but working on different levels.

I feel like Jerry Horne watching Richard's death through the wrong end of a pair of binoculars may have been a dig at those people Lynch berates for watching films on their "fucking telephone". A lot of stuff like that. Commentary about filmmaking, artistic integrity, audience expectations, making fun of Lynch's own public persona and so on, all the meta-jokes happening parallel to the plot.

Tarantino said after watching Fire Walk With Me that Lynch had disappeared up his own ass and he wasn't going to watch any more of his films. I think Hutch and Chantel may be Lynch telling Tarantino to eat shit. And recreating the ending of Se7en, but with a cherry pie in the box, ho ho.
Anthony Flack
Greatest Man Who Ever Lived
Greatest Man Who Ever Lived
 
Posts: 8929
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2012 12:27 am
Location: New Zealand

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby thelonelymastodronus on Thu Nov 16, 2017 11:27 am

Really good read on DL and The Return right here:
David Lynch's Late Style
Your taste is in your ass
User avatar
thelonelymastodronus
museum trash
museum trash
 
Posts: 1026
Joined: Fri May 10, 2013 1:14 pm
Location: among the house flies

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby llllllllllllllllllllllll on Thu Nov 16, 2017 11:53 am

Volume One wrote:
llllllllllllllllllllllll wrote:They had the first season on the plane and I thought I'd rewatch it. Forgot how fucking brutal that pilot is. Christ. I need to start the new season soon - I keep thinking that I need to watch the first two seasons again, though I'm not sure how necessary it is. May be unnecessarily holding myself back.


It's a good idea, but make sure you're high for the red ones.

Image


I was afraid to read this thread again because of spoilers, but I’m glad I poked my head in months later to see a response! Officially, it looks live I’ve seen all the good ones minus episode 22. Maybe I’ll give it another go from where I left off but I am NOT watching the pilot again. Not that it’s not good, it’s just a tough watch. They really drill into your head the effect her death had on her family in a way I don’t often see in television shows.
llllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll
User avatar
llllllllllllllllllllllll
Man with Encyclopedic Knowledge
Man with Encyclopedic Knowledge
 
Posts: 5275
Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 4:32 pm
Location: Texas

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby blackmarket on Thu Nov 16, 2017 12:39 pm

So, I have been trying in vain to get through the original series. A few episodes into the second season, I really don't think I can do it. I am trying in the most earnest ways to stay interested. I just can't find much of anything that I care about here. It's soapy, badly-acted garbage television. I understand what Lynch is going for here, it's just not for me.

My question - do I need to finish out the twenty-something remaining episodes of the first iteration to begin The Return? I know the general story, but not really sure if The Return is somewhat written in a way that welcomes the uninitiated and those not fully up to speed.
User avatar
blackmarket
meatball enthusiast
meatball enthusiast
 
Posts: 1268
Joined: Fri Jun 30, 2006 10:14 pm

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby sitwell on Thu Nov 16, 2017 1:02 pm

Twin Peaks is neither plot driven nor character driven. It's something else. David Lynch is big into transcendental meditation so that might give you some idea of where he's coming from. You can't really look at it like a narrative.

Some people like it a lot, some people hate it a lot. I would try it from just a "thing happening" angle, but it's not for everyone. It's not Game of Thrones or something.
sitwell
denny dias
denny dias
 
Posts: 638
Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2013 11:10 am

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby blackmarket on Thu Nov 16, 2017 1:07 pm

sitwell wrote:Twin Peaks is neither plot driven nor character driven. It's something else. David Lynch is big into transcendental meditation so that might give you some idea of where he's coming from. You can't really look at it like a narrative.

Some people like it a lot, some people hate it a lot. I would try it from just a "thing happening" angle, but it's not for everyone. It's not Game of Thrones or something.


Yes, I understand. I am not going to make through the second season. There is no way. The Return seems more artful, with better cinematography and performances. It looks like something I would love. Should I give it a try, or will I be lost?
User avatar
blackmarket
meatball enthusiast
meatball enthusiast
 
Posts: 1268
Joined: Fri Jun 30, 2006 10:14 pm

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby sitwell on Thu Nov 16, 2017 1:19 pm

blackmarket wrote:
sitwell wrote:Twin Peaks is neither plot driven nor character driven. It's something else. David Lynch is big into transcendental meditation so that might give you some idea of where he's coming from. You can't really look at it like a narrative.

Some people like it a lot, some people hate it a lot. I would try it from just a "thing happening" angle, but it's not for everyone. It's not Game of Thrones or something.


Yes, I understand. I am not going to make through the second season. There is no way. The Return seems more artful, with better cinematography and performances. It looks like something I would love. Should I give it a try, or will I be lost?

I would say it won't be as rewarding, but I'd give it a shot. It does seem like the people that liked the early ones liked the new ones better than people who never saw them (and yeah, season two was really spotty).
sitwell
denny dias
denny dias
 
Posts: 638
Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2013 11:10 am

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby Auntie Ovipositor on Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:56 pm

blackmarket wrote:So, I have been trying in vain to get through the original series. A few episodes into the second season, I really don't think I can do it. I am trying in the most earnest ways to stay interested. I just can't find much of anything that I care about here. It's soapy, badly-acted garbage television. I understand what Lynch is going for here, it's just not for me.

My question - do I need to finish out the twenty-something remaining episodes of the first iteration to begin The Return? I know the general story, but not really sure if The Return is somewhat written in a way that welcomes the uninitiated and those not fully up to speed.


blackmarket wrote:I am not going to make through the second season. There is no way. The Return seems more artful, with better cinematography and performances. It looks like something I would love. Should I give it a try, or will I be lost?


The Return is definitely more artful and you don't really need to have seen everything that's come before to get something out of it. But it's really an entirely different beast than the original TV series. Fire Walk With Me is more of a precursor in tone and style - The Return is a continuation of that set of ideas more than anything in the TV shows.

For me... it didn't work. The "badly-acted garbage television" trope is still everywhere without ever actually going anywhere, and the range of characters goes from zero- to one-dimensional. There are several stories, but none of them relate much to the arc of the show. It is overwhelmingly committed to the soap opera trope. If those things are what you value, this is not going to make you happy. The show is willfully committed to not having things like acting and exposition.

There are good parts sprinkled throughout that make it far less of a slog than the original 2 series, and the high points are definitely higher, but there are an awful lot of arbitrary stretches that don't mean much outside of their own existence. None of the new ones were directed by Diane Keaton, so the lows aren't as low.

And a lot of people genuinely loved it, so there's that.

Episode 8 remains a really wonderful love letter to avant garde cinema of the last century, and manages to tell a lot of story without locking anything down. If you find you're not enjoying the series (and my hunch is you might not), at least skip forward to that episode.
The Loyalists are a rock band from Oakland, California
User avatar
Auntie Ovipositor
Leader with Extraordinary Personality
Leader with Extraordinary Personality
 
Posts: 2946
Joined: Tue Jun 09, 2009 1:52 pm
Location: Oakland, baby

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby Anthony Flack on Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:04 pm

Should I give it a try, or will I be lost?


Yes, and yes.

If you want to be slightly less lost, watch the final episode of S2, and Fire Walk With Me.

Maybe I’ll give it another go from where I left off but I am NOT watching the pilot again. Not that it’s not good, it’s just a tough watch. They really drill into your head the effect her death had on her family in a way I don’t often see in television shows.


See above. Just watch the last episode. And if you thought the pilot episode was emotionally distressing, Fire Walk With Me is even more harrowing.
Last edited by Anthony Flack on Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Anthony Flack
Greatest Man Who Ever Lived
Greatest Man Who Ever Lived
 
Posts: 8929
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2012 12:27 am
Location: New Zealand

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby Redline on Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:10 pm

That's good advice. The second season of Twin Peaks was brutal, especially in the pre-DVR days, when we were watching it live on TV, wading through tons of commercials and hoping something in the show would get going, and it didn't get going until the very end, you kids don't know how good you have it these days.

I still plan to binge watch the new show, but I'm sure I have a ton of other things to do before that happens.
User avatar
Redline
Present-day God
Present-day God
 
Posts: 9215
Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2004 7:53 pm
Location: Milwaukee, WI

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby blackmarket on Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:21 pm

Thanks, dudes.
User avatar
blackmarket
meatball enthusiast
meatball enthusiast
 
Posts: 1268
Joined: Fri Jun 30, 2006 10:14 pm

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby andyman on Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:41 pm

I view the Twin Peaks serieses as shit sandwiches, in the kindest sense possible: good wholewheat bread, nice centre piece, everything between them just intolerable.

The 90s film is genuinely great in its own right.
offal wrote:I just want to be able to play bitchin' single-stroke rolls before I die
User avatar
andyman
Humankind's Greatest Musical Genius
Humankind's Greatest Musical Genius
 
Posts: 4128
Joined: Sat Apr 15, 2006 9:31 am
Location: Cambridge

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby llllllllllllllllllllllll on Thu Nov 16, 2017 5:08 pm

Sam Esmail of Mr Robot interviews Mark Frost. There are a couple spoilers but probably nothing that you haven’t already heard about. Talks more about how they started up the new season again and the general philosophy behind the design of the show. At one point Frost says that Twin Peaks “isn’t a treasure hunt” but that it has its own internal logic that may only make since to him and David Lynch.
Didn’t talk very much about Mr Robot, but Frost is a fan. I do like that show a lot.
llllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll
User avatar
llllllllllllllllllllllll
Man with Encyclopedic Knowledge
Man with Encyclopedic Knowledge
 
Posts: 5275
Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 4:32 pm
Location: Texas

Re: tvshow: twin peaks

Postby El Protoolio on Thu Nov 16, 2017 5:34 pm

blackmarket wrote:So, I have been trying in vain to get through the original series. A few episodes into the second season, I really don't think I can do it. I am trying in the most earnest ways to stay interested. I just can't find much of anything that I care about here. It's soapy, badly-acted garbage television. I understand what Lynch is going for here, it's just not for me.

My question - do I need to finish out the twenty-something remaining episodes of the first iteration to begin The Return? I know the general story, but not really sure if The Return is somewhat written in a way that welcomes the uninitiated and those not fully up to speed.


Just skip to the last episode or two, watch the film, then watch the Return.

If you can fit in reading the Secret History between the film and the Return then even better. Then read the Final Dossier. But you don’t have to read either book.
User avatar
El Protoolio
Present-day God
Present-day God
 
Posts: 9172
Joined: Sun Dec 07, 2003 11:18 am
Location: Your Mom

PreviousNext

Return to Crap / Not Crap

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Baidu [Spider], Majestic-12 [Bot], voncorn and 8 guests