ATP Nightmare before Christmas

[holmes]

They need to get neil young.

[Dovey]

I've heard that Odd Future will be playing, is this true?

Yep, right after the skate demonstration (steve's gonna do a kickflip)

[Ptommydski]

<cough>Kogumaza</cough>

YES.

[Dudley]

<cough>Kogumaza</cough>

YES.

Sorry. Didn't catch that. Did you say kogumaza?

[gjhardwick]

Kogu-what?

KOGUMAZA YOU SAY?

[aldofarian]

To address the rumours some of you may have seen; there are some changes currently happening with the company, but none of the currently scheduled events or future events will be affected

The rumours have suggested ATP might be going into administration.

[cjh]

The rumours have suggested ATP might be going into administration.

Hope not but this looks rather worrying.

[MrFood]

Kickstarter campaign to buy out ATP in 5... 4... 3...

[mattgringo]

That is not administration, that is liquidation. They will start a new company and promote under a different name.

[Isabelle Gall]

Administration or liquidation, I'd still make sure to pay with a credit and not a debit card if you're planning on buying any tickets regardless.

[Surfrider]

As much as I agree that there are plenty of very good bands here in the UK, I personally am not too interested in seeing them at ATP. I can (and do) see many excellent UK bands almost on a weekly basis, so when I go to something like ATP, I want to see things I don't normally have the chance to see throughout the year. I'd rather see similar-level bands from overseas that wouldn't normally get the chance to play over here. Like several people have posted, there are already several mini-fests/weekenders and such over here with amazing line ups for cheap $$$.

Anyway, 'ZZ Top' please. And 'Crazy Horse'.

[ImDADA]

Good post, if it wasn't for ATP I wouldn't have seen Jesus Lizard or Sleep or the countless other bands they helped bring back from the dead to actually put on brilliant shows. I wouldn't have been able to watch Bernard Parmegiani and the Melvins a few hundred yards apart across an arcade.

[honeyisfunny]

As much as I agree that there are plenty of very good bands here in the UK, I personally am not too interested in seeing them at ATP. I can (and do) see many excellent UK bands almost on a weekly basis, so when I go to something like ATP, I want to see things I don't normally have the chance to see throughout the year. I'd rather see similar-level bands from overseas that wouldn't normally get the chance to play over here. Like several people have posted, there are already several mini-fests/weekenders and such over here with amazing line ups for cheap $$$.

Anyway, 'ZZ Top' please. And 'Crazy Horse'.

I think the point some people have made is that the equivalent doesn't exist overseas for European bands. American bands have never particularly struggled to come and tour over here because of the size of the country/continent and close proximity of cities coupled to the cheaper work permit situation for Americans coming to work here versus vice versa.
Plus, not everyone in the UK sees it the way you do and is hungry to see new bands play regularly. Playing ATP has become a badge of validity somehow and whilst I don't disagree with that, it's had the effect of further marginalising "underground" bands in the country that started the festival because they seem excluded from things. None of that is the festival's fault or the curator's fault I might add as it's unlikely that an American band is going to pass up bringing their friends and peers over the Atlantic in favour of bands they know less about and don't love to the same degree, but as the festival has reached a more mainstream crowd that crowd seems less interested in using it as the launching pad into new music than they used to seem to do. To me anyway.
A lot of bands that played that 2002 Shellac ATP have forged very healthy fanbases in the UK since because it seemed a lot of that festival was bands unknown to a lot of attendees - or at least unknown in a live, touring sense. I think that's something amazing that an artist like Nina Nastasia can still be respected and gather an audience 10 years on essentially because of that festival and being able to come and play over here for it. And being awesome helps of course, but for a lot of people in the UK our first exposure to her music was through that ATP. Danielson Famile, Fred Armisen, PW Long and more as well and, more to the point, having a band we love recommend music to us was one of the primary reasons to go. It was a continuation of what you said you do which is to constantly seek out new music and place value on it.
But as time has gone on, the crowd seems to be more like a normal festival crowd in terms of what they want and what they want to pay their cash for and so this exposure to new bands happens less and is less valued as part of the experience of the festival for those that go to it.
I think the point people were making about European bands playing is more that this desire to discover new music is what made ATP successful and might be what has been slightly lacking of late.
Again - not ATP's fault. I'd wager that putting it back in a smaller venue with a more social feel to it and having Shellac curate it again might be a good step towards sorting that out.

[Ptommydski]

Maybe a handful of people who will go to ATP will have heard of any of the Gringo bands and that's crazy because they are exactly the sort of bands who would easily slot into this sort of environment.

I don't see how a Shellac fan could not love The Unit Ama or Bilge Pump or I'm Being Good but they'll never hear these bands because they come from the UK and they're unlikely to be chosen by Mogwai (no disrespect to Mogwai either, they choose good, if predominantly US-based bands).

[mattgringo]

As much as I agree that there are plenty of very good bands here in the UK, I personally am not too interested in seeing them at ATP. I can (and do) see many excellent UK bands almost on a weekly basis, so when I go to something like ATP, I want to see things I don't normally have the chance to see throughout the year. I'd rather see similar-level bands from overseas that wouldn't normally get the chance to play over here. Like several people have posted, there are already several mini-fests/weekenders and such over here with amazing line ups for cheap $$$.

Anyway, 'ZZ Top' please. And 'Crazy Horse'.

I couldn't disagree with you more, which is why I stopped going! I would accept your position if when ATP do events abroad, British bands are invited to play by the curators. It doesn't seem that it works both ways.

ATP is the only festival of its type in the UK that does not support British music, that I can think of. That is fine, their choice. But I think ATP has unintentionally dimished the standing of "similar-level" British artists to the extent that "similar level" does not exist.

The ATP crowd is the same one that buys Gringo's releases. When I used to rock up and do my stall on the sly, I would regularly sell over £1000 of records. In one afternoon. Of bands not playing the festival. When the fans voted for the line-up, Bilge Pump and Lords got in the top 100. And no, I didn't vote!

I'm not saying ATP is shit or evil or the enemy, I like the folk who run it, I just feel it is a missed oppurtunity to do something truly amazing and support the great music coming out of this country. And I speak as someone who has promoted countless US bands and got pretty fed up with it.

[honeyisfunny]

Maybe a handful of people who will go to ATP will have heard of any of the Gringo bands and that's crazy because they are exactly the sort of bands who would easily slot into this sort of environment.

I don't see how a Shellac fan could not love The Unit Ama or Bilge Pump or I'm Being Good but they'll never hear these bands because they come from the UK and they're unlikely to be chosen by Mogwai (no disrespect to Mogwai either, they choose good, if predominantly US-based bands).

I should add that my blurb above isn't from the perspective of a band member. When I had the good fortune of playing ATP or of doing a stall there or just attending it's always been great and the way we were treated as a band was awesome. I would hate anyone to think that I would have any complaints about that. I'm not campaigning for inclusion of anything I have to do with, just trying to clarify what I thought some other folks had said. And Mogwai picked a whole host of great UK bands when they curated too to be fair to them and the US bands they did pick were done at a time when those bands rarely made it over to the UK (stuff like the For Carnation or Shellac even)

[ImDADA]

Moving to the bigger venue must have put pressures on the organisers to ask bigger bands to curate to help ensure it works on a financial level, perhaps moving back to camber will change the dynamic again. I just find it hard to get pissy about a group of people who consistently put on brilliant shows, bringing bands together that you ordinarily never get to see all in one place - some of the line ups over the past 4-5 years have been boring but it's up to the curators to choose who plays.

[honeyisfunny]

ATP is the only festival of its type in the UK that does not support British music, that I can think of. That is fine, their choice. But I think ATP has unintentionally dimished the standing of "similar-level" British artists to the extent that "similar level" does not exist.

That's exactly it. When Mogwai curated, or Shellac curated it felt like a chance to see real overseas contemporaries of UK bands I loved and it was kind of 'on the level' if you like. Now it feels like those UK bands are on a lower rung because some punters feel the festival is picked purely on merit by great taste makers and, if any of the UK bands were any good, they'd be on the bill so if they're not - they're not.
This isn't a fault of anyone except people who form opinions like that and there's probably some truth in it but all I know is, 10 years ago it'd have been a fuckload easier to get those people out to a local show on a week night than it is now and that's something, as someone who puts on a lot of gigs, it's been hard to ignore.

[honeyisfunny]

Moving to the bigger venue must have put pressures on the organisers to ask bigger bands to curate to help ensure it works on a financial level, perhaps moving back to camber will change the dynamic again. I just find it hard to get pissy about a group of people who consistently put on brilliant shows, bringing bands together that you ordinarily never get to see all in one place - some of the line ups over the past 4-5 years have been boring but it's up to the curators to choose who plays.

I would hate to be seen as pissy - just being reflective on over 10 years of the festival and how it's changed the landscape of music in the country it's held in for better and for worse. It's interesting to look at the growth of something like Supersonic in comparison and how they chose to handle that and make the festival continue and change with each year. And let's not forget while the curator picks the bands, ATP picks the curator.
As a shining example of how to treat bands and how to treat the public it's absolutely outstanding though - would never say anything else and I agree that a move back to Camber is awesome. I heard the Queen Vic isn't there anymore though? Say it ain't so...

[Ptommydski]

Comparatively, at the IBYM ATP which I was at a few weeks ago in London, there was Mogwai, Yuck and...after that I'm struggling to name another UK act.

There's a scepticism towards UK bands and I can't help but think it's being at least partially perpetuated by the invisible glass ceiling of cynicism and disinterest which keeps the genuinely great bands from reaching an audience who would logically appreciate them if they could see them in the context of an environment like ATP.