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band: nick cave and the bad seeds

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Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds

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NOT CRAP
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Total votes : 163

Re: band: nick cave and the bad seeds

Postby iembalm on Fri Oct 04, 2019 2:57 pm

There is one particular post in his Red Hand Files correspondence where he answers a fan who asked how his wife was doing. His response to that, I think, should be read before taking the lyrics to this new album on board.

It's here:

https://www.theredhandfiles.com/how-is-susie-doing/
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Re: band: nick cave and the bad seeds

Postby Andrew. on Fri Oct 04, 2019 3:26 pm

iembalm wrote:There is one particular post in his Red Hand Files correspondence where he answers a fan who asked how his wife was doing. His response to that, I think, should be read before taking the lyrics to this new album on board.

It's here:

https://www.theredhandfiles.com/how-is-susie-doing/


Too bad that he thinks the lives and human rights of the Palestinian people (some of whom, strangely enough, are wives, or have wives, or are the children and sisters and friends and cousins of wives) are secondary to his all-important-feelings as a brilliant musician who writes laughable, hackneyed lyrics.

His wife means a lot to him. The lives of millions of other wives whose political struggle threatens his artistic ego are nothing to him.
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Re: band: nick cave and the bad seeds

Postby iembalm on Fri Oct 04, 2019 4:19 pm

Here's what Andrew. is referring to (I assume - maybe he has spoken to the man and has some insight that I don't):

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2018/ ... -brian-eno

One could, of course take Andrew.'s post and replace certain words with other words in order to condemn Cave for not being on the correct side of pretty much any issue one would care to. Veganism, gun control, the vaccination debate, what have you.

My own opinion is that declaring that the artistic exploration of grief of someone whose political, moral, or philosophical viewpoints differ from your own is negated or less "pure" artistically because of those opinions is puerile and self-aggrandizing, Maybe I'm a bit biased in that regard because of having served grieving people for 22 years and recognizing that grief is a universal emotion that isn't any easier to deal with because you think compassionately about those less fortunate, recycle, vote for the kinder and gentler candidate, donate to worthy causes, play catch with your son, and do the dishes every night. Nor is it more navigable if you are a rat bastard with no regard for anyone but yourself.

And of course the appropriate response to any criticism of artistic expression that begins with, "How dare you...?" is "Go fuck yourself." Not that I presume to speak for Cave, of course. He's much more eloquent than me and what he creates is infinitely more deserving of attention.
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Re: band: nick cave and the bad seeds

Postby Angus Jung on Fri Oct 04, 2019 4:58 pm

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Last edited by Angus Jung on Fri Oct 04, 2019 5:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: band: nick cave and the bad seeds

Postby NewDarkAge on Fri Oct 04, 2019 4:59 pm

iembalm wrote:There is one particular post in his Red Hand Files correspondence where he answers a fan who asked how his wife was doing. His response to that, I think, should be read before taking the lyrics to this new album on board.

It's here:

https://www.theredhandfiles.com/how-is-susie-doing/


I’ve read and enjoyed a bunch of the Red Hand Files correspondence. It’s tender and compassionate writing. That’s part of why I felt disappointed by some of the lyrics on the new record. The music is moving when you know the context, because any person singing about going through something like that is moving, unless you’re a robot. But where it shoots for universality it seems to me to end up in generality, reaching for well-worn images of seas and winds and horses and the like, but not really doing anything to take those images somewhere new.
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Re: band: nick cave and the bad seeds

Postby Into the Void on Fri Oct 04, 2019 9:31 pm

One of my favorite artists, but a few things I disliked about Ghosteen: the album title, the album cover, the songs, the synth sounds (all of which sound like they were made with a MicroKorg by someone who didn't want to venture beyond presets), the (mostly piss poor) melodies, the vocals/vocal affectations, and the incredibly pretentious lyrics. I'm aware of the circumstances, but that doesn't make anyone defend Tears in Heaven.
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Re: band: nick cave and the bad seeds

Postby WeStartToDrift on Fri Oct 04, 2019 10:33 pm

Into the Void wrote:the synth sounds (all of which sound like they were made with a MicroKorg by someone who didn't want to venture beyond presets),


It seems like Warren's dive into synths stopped abruptly at the Microkorg.
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Re: band: nick cave and the bad seeds

Postby cneutron on Mon Oct 07, 2019 12:48 am

Andrew. wrote:
iembalm wrote:There is one particular post in his Red Hand Files correspondence where he answers a fan who asked how his wife was doing. His response to that, I think, should be read before taking the lyrics to this new album on board.

It's here:

https://www.theredhandfiles.com/how-is-susie-doing/


Too bad that he thinks the lives and human rights of the Palestinian people (some of whom, strangely enough, are wives, or have wives, or are the children and sisters and friends and cousins of wives) are secondary to his all-important-feelings as a brilliant musician who writes laughable, hackneyed lyrics.

His wife means a lot to him. The lives of millions of other wives whose political struggle threatens his artistic ego are nothing to him.


Too much, man.
Just like my initial reply.
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Re: band: nick cave and the bad seeds

Postby Antero on Mon Oct 07, 2019 2:29 am

NewDarkAge wrote:Ordinarily, this type of writing would be called hackneyed. Does this really do it for anyone? “Cool evening air”? “Winds of longing”?

More to the point: riders, definitionally, don't have sails
Is you crazy baby, I gots to grind
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Re: band: nick cave and the bad seeds

Postby Ike on Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:12 am

This new one isn't doing it for me at all.

The last two are the best albums of his entire run in my opinion, so I was PRIMED for this one.

Just seems flat.

Maybe it'll land after a few more listens.

I hope they bring Grinderman back TO ROCK.
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Re: band: nick cave and the bad seeds

Postby kaleb on Mon Oct 07, 2019 9:35 am

Saw the Q&A show last night in Austin, Cave played Into My Arms, which I mostly think of in connection with some friends who used it as their wedding processional song. Last night he played it as the end of a response to a question about grief from a guy whose wife had died a few years ago, and I thought it was incredibly powerful to hear that song from the perspective of someone grieving, basically the opposite of the wedding context. I cried.

On the crappier side, in his response to a question about political divisiveness in the world today, Cave explicitly went to horseshoe theory. Ignoring that and a few cringe-y questions, it was a very good evening.
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Re: band: nick cave and the bad seeds

Postby cneutron on Mon Oct 07, 2019 12:18 pm

Ike wrote:This new one isn't doing it for me at all.


I've only listened once so far, and I wasn't super blown away, but i'll give it another chance.

Ike wrote:The last two are the best albums of his entire run in my opinion, so I was PRIMED for this one.

Just seems flat.


I opined about Push the Sky Away when it came out, but after hearing Jubilee Street Live I came around to that song and another. Skeleton Tree did absolutely nothing for me. All respect!
There are still many Bad Seeds records I can listen to instead of those. I always love an artist doing big swings.
Not for me.

Ike wrote:I hope they bring Grinderman back TO ROCK.


Man, if there ever was a time for the visceral thrill that is Grinderman, it's now man.

Back to Bad Seeds.
I'm always blown away by how few people appear to have heard DIG, LAZARUS!!! DIG!
Which is the record before Push the Sky Away. about a quarter of it is a sleazy Vegas record and the songs are awesome.

Meanwhile, I was listening to people losing their minds over Skeleton Tree and (as said) it just... it isn't for me.
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Re: band: nick cave and the bad seeds

Postby Pure L on Tue Oct 08, 2019 12:39 pm

I dig the new one. It's wicked mellow/emotional but, hey... Nick Cave. He's got enough great lyrics that the trite ones almost seem like a statement kinda-sorta. Nick dgaf.

Some of the synth-sounds though...

Yeah. Kinda goofy.

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Re: band: nick cave and the bad seeds

Postby cerebralheadtrip on Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:11 am

the cover rules as does the album. not really a headspace i want to or can imagine spending much time in however.



this is still funny
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Re: band: nick cave and the bad seeds

Postby llllllllllllllllllllllll on Thu Mar 05, 2020 12:08 pm

I will never understand why they mixed the Tender Prey version of The Mercy Seat like they did. It’s pretty wild , predicted Godspeed You Black Emperor in a lot of ways, and it’s absolutely freakish but it still sounds like shit!
That type of Bad Seeds performance, where they sound like hurricane force winds in a way that only big rock ensembles can, is definitely their best stuff. I just wish they’d have committed to that sort of thing for a whole record more then they did.
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Re: band: nick cave and the bad seeds

Postby Zorg on Wed May 20, 2020 7:27 am

I'm partial to Henry's Dream. I think that rhythm playing Mick Harvey is doing there on acoustic is totally fantastic. I was a bit frustrated that they never repeated that sound, as I thought it dynamic and unique too. Sort of like a Violent Femmes, Pixies, Psycho Killer/Street Fighting Man sorta thing, but more baroque of course. As it turns out there was a story behind it:

São Paolo resident Cave is inspired to make a harsh, “violent” acoustic record – but the band is encouraged to use a producer. Famed Neil Young man David Briggs is chosen, but it’s not a happy outcome.

Cave: “The idea for Henry’s Dream for me came from being in Brazil and seeing these guys in the streets playing acoustic guitars that were really fucked up and hammering out these songs on them; a style of street singing that was in your face, but acoustic.”
Harvey: “Nick wanted there to be a lot of harsh acoustic guitar, and a lot of that is still there. But we recorded it in the wrong studio. We recorded it in a rock studio, Sound City in Van Nuys, California – perfectly decent, but not right for the Bad Seeds.”
Cave: “Those great Neil Young records sound like it’s some guys standing there, playing their music, and that’s the fucking end of it – so David Briggs seemed like the right kind of guy. But as it turned out… he was hugely… He… I mean, he was a fucking nightmare, that guy. I mean, [chuckles] he really was. I know he’s dead now and all, but, fuck, man. Each day he took it from being a violent fucked-up acoustic record to being a fucked-up electric record. But fucked-up in the wrong way. I put a lot of energy into the writing of that record, and then for each day to see it drift away… it was a horrible, horrible experience.”
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Re: band: nick cave and the bad seeds

Postby bashar on Wed May 20, 2020 9:57 am

Nick Cave's whole post-Birthday Party body of work has this breathing-down-your-neck PUA/date rapist vibe that makes my skin crawl (not in a good way). The original goth-turned-"mature"-phony-spiritual-guru. Crap.
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