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Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Vote and debate.

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Caroline, NO!!!!

Sgt. Pepper
36
44%
Pet Sounds
45
56%
 
Total votes : 81

Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby Awesome_Komodo on Fri Oct 01, 2010 9:49 am

cwiko wrote:Oh, and all of McCartney's songs blow compared to Wilson's? Maybe a lot of them could be seen that way, but I'd never go so overboard as to say that all of them do.
This was in reference to his songs on Sgt. Pepper's, not McCartney's whole canon.
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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby jimmy two hands on Fri Oct 01, 2010 9:51 am

Sid Hartha wrote:
cwiko wrote:
Awesome_Komodo wrote:Pet Sounds wins for so many reasons. All of McCartney's songs blow compared Wilson's songs. So it's basically a few great Lennon tracks vs. an entire album of Wilson's chamber pop.


This to me is, at least, why Sgt. Pepper wins. A few great Lennon songs > Wilson's entire cabal.

Oh, and all of McCartney's songs blow compared to Wilson's? Maybe a lot of them could be seen that way, but I'd never go so overboard as to say that all of them do.

Fixing A Hole < the rest of Sgt Peppers

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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby fredrock on Fri Oct 01, 2010 10:46 am

This is a repost from the "Is SPLHCB over-rated" thread. Just my take---
I was right in the heart of the times, active is bands and listening to everything.
Also, understand that Revolver was my favorite album, this is solely referencing IMPACT.

Hoping not to appear pedantic, I would offer this opinion. You must understand that R&R was still very much an infant when first the Beach Boys, and then the Beatles appeared on the scene. There were mighty social forces working tirelessly to quash this "bastard of legitimate music." Hard to imagine but "guardians of purity" from classical, standard pop, swing, folk, C & W and even jazz considered R&R to be a pit of depravity populated principally by untalented greaser hillbillies, urban toughs, bikers and faithless panderers. Good kids needed to be protected, therefore this abomination must die. Elvis was "The King" and the form was all about "You Ain't Nothin' but a Hound Dog" and back seat "petting".
So along come these two moptop "combos" with their funny hair and funnier clothes. Branded almost immediately as light weight, flash in the pan-they'll be gone tomorrow fads, they received unimaginable amounts of harsh criticism and outright hatred. Earlier groups had been easier to control because they were beholden to record companies where the formula had always been to match performers with songwriters, an arrangement that suited the big labels well. They could make you, or break you on a whim.
These two bands were different. They composed and arranged most of their music and the longer they stayed in the game, the more they learned and the smarter they got. Each successive release took them further along down the path of artistic and creative control. They just kept besting their critics with better and better songs--complete catalogs of really innovative stuff. They simply could not be denied.

Both Pet Sounds and Sgt. Peppers were experiments, to see just how far these two formidable musical entities could travel into the world of big time, serious musical production. As I stated earlier, these were essentially Declarartions of Independence to all the naysayers who had been dogging them all these years.
"Take this all you doubters--we can play at your level now , so stuff it!! R&R is fully fledged, so get used to it, we ain't going away!!!"

FREEDOM_FREEDOM__FREEDOM

Everyone recognized it; R & R was here to stay.

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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby LBx on Fri Oct 01, 2010 10:58 am

i'll have to pass on both.
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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby japmn on Fri Oct 01, 2010 4:52 pm

Pet Sounds>Sgt. Pepper>Odessey and Oracle>S.F. Sorrow>Their Majesty's Satanic Request

Each record just barely better than the one it trumps. Just barely.
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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby ergo space pig on Fri Oct 01, 2010 5:42 pm

japmn wrote:Pet Sounds>Sgt. Pepper>Odessey and Oracle>S.F. Sorrow>Their Majesty's Satanic Request

Each record just barely better than the one it trumps. Just barely.


What about Forever Changes? Or Village Green Preservation Society? I think I like both of those better than any you listed there, and I like all of them except for TSMR.

As far as Pet Sounds vs. Sgt. Pepper, I like Pet Sounds better (yes even the two instrumentals), but I still think Sgt. Pepper is a good album with a some amazing moments on it. The concept is and always was pretty stupid though.
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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby rayword45 on Fri Aug 14, 2015 11:59 am

Don't know why I found this thread, but regardless of how much I like Pet Sounds (let's assume I thought it was positively mediocre), Sgt Peppers is worse than just about any other Beatles album, or for the record most albums out there. Dire, dated piece of trash.
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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby soundsofcallado on Fri Aug 14, 2015 3:18 pm

Isabelle Gall wrote:Both albums have been reduced to a shorthand reference for a glockenspiel overdub by many a terrible band (string section=musical ambition) as well as having an entire industry seemingly dedicated to writing completely redundant articles about them, bewitched as they are by reissues of 60's albums by english speaking mainstream white rock/pop musicians. The supposed cultural and artistic significance of both is bloated beyond all meaningful comprehension.

I guess 'Smile' is going to be the big discussion point in this thread, to which i'll add that I still consider this to be very much an uncompleted project. If it had been completed and released back then all would be very different, one way or another.

However, 'Pet Sounds' by a mile. Not even close.


Pet Sounds, easy.

I always sort of thought, despite how ass backward this may be, if Smile had come out then as a finished product we wouldn't even be discussing the Beatles at all.

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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby wotown on Fri Aug 14, 2015 3:33 pm

1. Village Green Preservation Society (peak Kinks)
2. Odessey and Oracle (wish they'd kept going)
3. Pet Sounds (one of their peaks)
4. Forever Changes (peak Lee; wish it had more MacLean)
5. S.F. Sorrow (haven't fully digested the Pretty Things, but I always like it when I back to it)
6. Sgt. Pepper (they were better before this, and again after this)
7. Their Satanic Majesties' Request (ditto)
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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby AnthonyVillalobos on Fri Aug 14, 2015 8:26 pm

Pet Sounds.

Fuck Sgt. Pepper.
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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby m3kcomp on Fri Aug 14, 2015 10:52 pm

Revolver over Pet Sounds easy...but Pet Sounds WAAAAY over Pepper's.

Pepper's came out after VU & Nico, no? Screw Sgt. Pepper and his dumb band...such overrated BS when taken as a whole.
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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby Limmo on Fri Aug 14, 2015 11:22 pm

The Who Sell Out ( expanded CD version ) > Odessey and Oracle > Village Green > Peppers > Pet
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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby numberthirty on Fri Aug 14, 2015 11:32 pm

AnthonyVillalobos wrote:Pet Sounds.

Fuck Sgt. Pepper.


Their Satanic Majesties Request is probably better than Sgt. Pepper.
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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby numberthirty on Fri Aug 14, 2015 11:40 pm

Come to think of it, "Child Of The Moon" smokes both of these records.
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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby a leg plaster on Sat Aug 15, 2015 12:38 am

Pet Sounds for me, easy.
(exaggeration)
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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby geiginni on Sat Aug 15, 2015 11:49 am

Both of these are overrated records. I'll pick Sgt. Pepper because the arrangements more aggressive and forward and it's not a documentary of American weenie-boy teen mental illness.

Jesus Herbert Christ people, if this is really the pinnacle of musical art for anyone, it's time to pull your head out of the goddamn sand that is the late 20th century western world and expand your goddamn horizons a little bit.

The worship of either of these records are the musical equivalent of thinking Judy Bloom should've been a five-time Pulitzer Prize winner.
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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby Gibbs on Sat Aug 15, 2015 12:49 pm

Sgt. Pepper has one good song on it. Pet Sounds has 13.
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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby jakethesnake on Sat Aug 15, 2015 1:18 pm

The argument about "Pet sounds" not being "rock" enough is ridiculous to me; literally the first time I heard that album in it's entirety, I thought about Spector and his girlbands, I thought Sinatra, I thought the fucking Platters and the Four Freshmen-I did not ONCE think of it as "rock" and I still don't. Great, amazing album? Sure. Rock? No. People who want to hear rock will for all eternity be disappointed by this album...

Sgt Peppers meanwhile is just a weak album by Beatles standards;Lennon was not on top of his game with the exception of *that* song (you know, the one with the McCartney bridge) while McCartney continued towards his "genre-exercise" bullshit; I give props to "Fixing a hole" and "Getting Better" (which BTW is Beatles B-side quality) and the blatantly Beach Boys inspired "She's leaving home"-that's all.

Oh yeah, the title track kind of rocks in a cool way but it is too slight to make much an impression.

Pet Sounds by a billion miles, I still don't think it's rock though whereas Sgt Peppers could at least make a tiny claim for being that; bad rock compared with Revolver or Rubber Soul but whatever...
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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby Anthony Flack on Sat Aug 15, 2015 6:05 pm

jakethesnake wrote:Lennon was not on top of his game with the exception of *that* song (you know, the one with the McCartney bridge)


Well, that and the one that went out as a single instead. 'She's Leaving Home' though, I woudn't give a pass to that one - it's barf.

I also don't understand this 'it's not rock' criticism. Ok, so it's not rock. Agreed, fine, so what?
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Re: Thunderdome: Sgt. Pepper vs. Pet Sounds

Postby sulfur)addict on Sat Aug 15, 2015 6:21 pm

fredrock wrote:
Hoping not to appear pedantic, I would offer this opinion. You must understand that R&R was still very much an infant when first the Beach Boys, and then the Beatles appeared on the scene. There were mighty social forces working tirelessly to quash this "bastard of legitimate music." Hard to imagine but "guardians of purity" from classical, standard pop, swing, folk, C & W and even jazz considered R&R to be a pit of depravity populated principally by untalented greaser hillbillies, urban toughs, bikers and faithless panderers. Good kids needed to be protected, therefore this abomination must die. Elvis was "The King" and the form was all about "You Ain't Nothin' but a Hound Dog" and back seat "petting".
So along come these two moptop "combos" with their funny hair and funnier clothes. Branded almost immediately as light weight, flash in the pan-they'll be gone tomorrow fads, they received unimaginable amounts of harsh criticism and outright hatred. Earlier groups had been easier to control because they were beholden to record companies where the formula had always been to match performers with songwriters, an arrangement that suited the big labels well. They could make you, or break you on a whim.
These two bands were different. They composed and arranged most of their music and the longer they stayed in the game, the more they learned and the smarter they got. Each successive release took them further along down the path of artistic and creative control. They just kept besting their critics with better and better songs--complete catalogs of really innovative stuff. They simply could not be denied.

Both Pet Sounds and Sgt. Peppers were experiments, to see just how far these two formidable musical entities could travel into the world of big time, serious musical production. As I stated earlier, these were essentially Declarartions of Independence to all the naysayers who had been dogging them all these years.
"Take this all you doubters--we can play at your level now , so stuff it!! R&R is fully fledged, so get used to it, we ain't going away!!!"

FREEDOM_FREEDOM__FREEDOM

Everyone recognized it; R & R was here to stay.

THERE IS YOUR IMPACT !!


This is all I've ever heard about Sgt Pepper's and it still sounds like a novelty record. Garbage.

I like Pet Sounds. I dunno if it's a "mature" effort or whatever, but it works. Wonderful songs, great production, sighs aplenty.
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